Navigating the Consulting World with Scott Trumpolt

Tim Melanson: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to today’s episode of the Work at Home Rockstar podcast. We’re talking to the owner of Trimpled Compensation Design Solutions, which is PCDS. And what he does is he helps to figure out what you should pay different types of jobs within your company.

That’s a Quick version of saying it, right? So we’re talking to Scott Trumbold. Hey, Scott, you ready to rock?

Scott Trumpolt: Absolutely.

Tim Melanson: So tell me a story of success in your business or even your personal life that we can be inspired by.

Scott Trumpolt: 1 of the big stories of success came fairly early when I started my business over a dozen years ago as an independent consultant, I thought I’d have to work my way up. Maybe do some small projects. Maybe not so interesting. Just be an extra helping hand out there. But what I found is within a relatively short period of time, I got an opportunity to develop a full pay structure and most importantly, a career architecture system, which [00:01:00] is basically, how do you classify different jobs?

In the marketplace for career development purposes, so I was able to link those 2 pieces together, which is really what we call a total reward solution where you’re linking pay to career development. So, for example, today, you’re a senior level accountant. Where do you go from there? Well, there are higher levels of accountant than senior.

You might become a specialist. You might become an expert. As an individual contributor, or you may go over to, become a people leader and move up the ladder that way. So the whole idea was this was a total reward solution that I got to implement early on. So I did that in the United States.

The reason it’s such a happy story for me is because then they wanted me to go over to China to their office there, fly the Dreamliner first class, which was quite a thrill, back in those days, the 787 and [00:02:00] get there. And it was fantastic because although there are obviously cultural differences.

And different approaches, it was the same company and those individuals wanted to have career development linked to their market pay. So, it was just a matter of really being a good listener and to get, that area of the world implemented with some modifications and what this whole process taught me was that the keys to being a successful consultant, at least in my area.

Of expertise was really going to be about your ideas, being able to travel to be able to work in a lot of different fields. And the fact that early on, I was able to get this project, which I love doing. And incidentally, ultimately, that project also had an impact. [00:03:00] From employee opinion surveys about their levels of engagement as it related to compensation.

And that is the best feeling the consultant have. It’s 1 thing to finish a project, and get paid for it. And That’s all well and good. But if you can actually move the needle. On employee engagement, because employee engagement is linked to business success. And so that was a very happy story for me. to take away again, those 2 different pieces.

Of, ideas that can travel and, the fact that employee engagement was impacted because that’s what I wanted to do as a consultant.

Tim Melanson: So now I understand that you had started in the corporate world and then you kind of branched out onto your own. So What was that transition like for you?

Scott Trumpolt: that actually, was the kind of story that is not as positive near the very end, but it triggered something better for myself. For the most part, I enjoyed my corporate career and the best thing that it ever did for me. [00:04:00] Was give me exposure to so many different types of experiences and mentors who knew more than I did learning how to become a best, a better listener.

That’s the most important skill you need. I think as a consultant, but with all the good things that were happening in corporate. I found that as I climbed the ladder, I was spending more and more time away from the things that I really wanted to do, such as design projects. more and more paperwork, more and more managing of other people, which, while I enjoyed mentoring, there are various tasks and things that take you away from the things that you love.

So, ultimately, what I did was I took one more corporate job. At the parent company, but it was over in Germany, and I did that for about a year and I thought that. This role would be more rewarding because it would be back to being an individual contributor and what they call the center of excellence. [00:05:00] So I would be like an expert advisor.

But what I found when I went over there was that it was even more bureaucratic. And because I was the new guy on the team. I was getting the least interesting projects and trying to coordinate ideas that would fit everywhere in the world was a very difficult task. a lot of things didn’t get past the talking stages.

But what I’m trying to say is, is that while that was a negative experience. In the sense that I wasn’t getting what I wanted out of work anymore, I just reached a level. Where I, just keep moving up the ladder and up the ladder, and that’s all Well,

and good. You get paid more. Usually, maybe you have more status, but if you’re an individual that really thrives on seeing something come alive.

That was a triggering point for me to say in a nice way in a few [00:06:00] words that I’m done with corporate. I want to strike out on my own. I believe that I’ve learned enough in 18 years. I had the right mentors and my path is different than other peoples. Other people will have a similar path that they can talk about.

But the point is that some. At some point in time, there’s some kind of triggering event, and that was the triggering event for me. So it was A bad story initially, because I was not happy being far away from home. in a different culture, and in a job, I always used to say to people, I could have lasted longer there.

If my job was interesting, or if I had my wife with me, but since I had neither one of those, it acted as a triggering point for something better. Down the road for me, and so that’s kind of my sad [00:07:00] story turned happy.

Tim Melanson: and that kind of leads into the next topic, which is the bad note, because in a lot of cases, this is so familiar, is that These mistakes are these, these, you know, low points end up translating into something better in the end. And so that’s why I want to sort of bring them out because I want to make sure that people understand that it’s okay to fail, right?

It’s okay to take those risks because those failures will end up being something good. And so I’m wondering, like, is there something since you’ve been on your business journey that didn’t go as planned that you recovered from?

Scott Trumpolt: Sure, there are things in any walk of life, whether you’re a consultant, or you’re working in corporate, it is true as an independent consultant. You have a lot more control. Over events, you’re making a lot of the decisions, which ultimately the responsibility rests on you. You need to make the decisions, but there are things that can be frustrating. that are not within [00:08:00] your control, for example, to give something specific. I had a project where I was working down in the Caribbean again. A lot of my projects are global. They’re not all in the US. And it was very difficult area to do what I kind of do because, they don’t have as much market of all the parts of the world.

They have the least market data. That’s reliable. And a lot of what I do requires market data that I can grab on to. So, I built a structure down there. and I really had to come up with some alternatives based on limited market data. And I worked and I worked and I worked at it to the point that I was putting in far more hours than I would get paid for.

But I really wanted to see it through and to do a good job. And I finally got it done. And then, lo and behold, this company got a new CEO and the new CEO didn’t cancel the project. they knew someone, that did what I did. And so I was [00:09:00] out the door, and they were put in my place, and this has only happened once to me.

And again, I got paid for the work I did, and there is nothing wrong with a CEO wanting to move in a different direction. That’s their right. That’s their prerogative. And that’s the thing you have to understand. Is that not everything you do, are you going to have control over? However, it was after putting in so much work and getting some good positive review.

Tim Melanson: it just was ultimately scrapped and I was back to square one feeling a little bit empty. Yeah. that’s a terrible feeling.

It’s that they found someone better in their minds. Right. And it’s even worse, when you actually put in some free work on it, add insult to injury, right? At least.

Scott Trumpolt: but those are the breaks. I mean, there are things that happen in people’s corporate world every day. The big difference to me about, being an independent consultant is, the control that you have over your destiny, good or [00:10:00] bad things are going to happen. I’ve had simpler things happen.

Where I work with a client for a number of years and again, there’s a change of management. They keep me on for a little while and then they decide, and how it’s done is really important. You know, if you get a letter in the mail, I mean, you have context your relationships with these people. I’ve been working for 5 years.

Don’t send me a letter. Just tell me I’m a big boy. I can handle it. but sometimes those situations work out for the better. I had a client, which I did a project for, and then there was no more budget for me to do anything else for them. A year later, there were some changes and they needed me back.

So it works both ways.

Tim Melanson: yeah. Yeah. And that’s true too. I mean, sometimes you’ll get, I know that I’ve been like pushed out. You know, in, in my business as well, and then brought back later when they realized that, oh, okay. So this person actually did know what they were talking about because, I mean, let’s face it in, [00:11:00] in today’s world, we’re all very much more connected than we were, you know, 20, 30 years ago through social media, it’s easier to market yourself now, but it’s harder.

To distinguish between the people that are just talking and the people that actually know what they’re doing. Right? And so you can end up in situations where you’re making some poor choices for some bad hires, because someone will tell you what you want to hear, but they can’t necessarily follow up on the promises that they’ve made.

Right?

Scott Trumpolt: Reached out to me because I had been so abruptly and, and I was a little annoyed and everything and like that, but you just got to get over it. You got to be a professional and you got to say, hey, this is a new opportunity. Let’s move forward, but, you know, you can’t help it as a human being. It’s like, do you dismiss me?

Tim Melanson: And now a month or 2 later. You there’s been a few changes [00:12:00] and you want me back. Okay, but if you’d handle it a little differently the 1st time. You know, but anyways, everything got resolved. I move forward Well, I know for me, like after having some of those experiences, that’s how I look at them now, like from the outset, like, so if I am getting pushed out or, or going in a different direction, I sort of tell myself, they’ll be back. And I find it really does help. It helps with my mindset. It helps, you know, when, when they do end up coming back, like you say, sheepishly, then you can just go like, yeah.

Hey, nice to see you again. It’s more of a. A happy, happy come back to me, right?

Scott Trumpolt: Yeah, you got it. You got to toughen your hide a little bit and I mean that not to you, but to all of us that it is a business and they do what they feel is right?

Tim Melanson: at any given moment. And you’re a small cog. in the wheel, just a little piece here. So you have to be respectful and mindful of that. [00:13:00] So Scott, tell me a little bit about practicing. So how is it that you, stay current and keep your skills up to par, I guess.

Scott Trumpolt: well, yes, it’s a good question. With the fact that I’m servicing on any given month, 7 or 8 clients. In various capacities and doing the type of work I love, I’m continually. Challenged, and so practice does make perfect There are a lot of different ways to gain what you need to be a consultant.

For me, though, it was that experience in corporate facing a lot of different types of experiences and getting mentored about different ways to approach a solution, that was the best way to go under the circumstances. So that built into me the confidence, going forward that I could handle just about everything when I went on my own.

If after 18 years. I didn’t have that ability then. Well, I wouldn’t have done this, [00:14:00] but, having said that, how I keep fresh on 1 of the things that I did all my work, although I had a masters in human resources, all of my, all of my training was work based 1 of the 1st things I did was when I left my, corporate career, I invested in myself and I got certified.

By World at Work, which is the. I took a series of exams to become a global remuneration professional, and I did that as a way to make sure I’m up to date on the latest trends following following the market. I, I think different laws that come out, I’m notified by various resources that I sign up to and I sit back when I hear about these new laws.

How is this going to impact me? Is it going to impact me positively or negatively? And, so that’s how I keep fresh the additional training. But mostly through continuous application, [00:15:00] when you’ve got 7 or 8 different clients. A month, all in different industries. With different issues, some very small issues day to day, others more long term.

The variety of work that you get as a consultant can be very rewarding and keep you sharp.

Tim Melanson: I’ve got a sort of an odd, I think it’s kind of an odd questions in a way. if you are working on a client, let’s just say that you’re working on a client that you’ve never worked on before, and in an area that you’ve never worked before, And you have to do some extra research, some extra kind of like learning their niche.

Do you charge them for that service? Or is that sort of like, no, you don’t. So how do you work that out?

Scott Trumpolt: well, the great thing is that in my line of work. Most companies use market based pay. So I have a starting point where things are very universal. [00:16:00] Whether I’m working for a manufacturing firm, they have different jobs, but the market value is the great equalizer. So, I’m in my particular profession.

It doesn’t vary that much. I can work for a lot of different companies and have, but I’m not sure that that hits at your core of the question. What was the core of the question

Tim Melanson: No, I think it does. Like, because there are, if you’re dealing with a whole lot of different types of clients, then every once in a while, there’s something That’ll come up that you’re like, Ooh, I don’t, I’m not really super on the ball on that particular thing. I need to go and do some extra research.

But, I find that, that, for me, I know that kind of look at it. Like there are certain things that you should know. And if you don’t know it, then it’s professional development on your part. And that doesn’t get charged to the client. And then there maybe are some things that the client is actually hiring you to go do that research.

And [00:17:00] of course you’re going to charge them for it. Right.

Scott Trumpolt: The other thing is that I live by a set of, Principles my model for my company. Is, founded on passion. Sustained by principles, and 1 of my principles is to not lead my clients astray. Like my clients will sometimes tell me. well, we need someone that knows a lot about executive compensation.

And depending on the type of project. What I’m trying to say is, or they’ll think that I know a lot about benefits. But if I don’t have expertise in a particular area, and there have been a few cases like this, I just tell them up front, you know, that even if I did all of this research, I don’t have the expertise that you need.

I cover a wide range of expertise, but even in my 30 years, I haven’t learned at all. And in those rare cases, I will just be honest with them and then sometimes they’ll dial [00:18:00] back and they’ll say, okay, well, we don’t need all this, but can you do this? And I say, yeah, and I can certainly provide you with some resources and I’m happy to do it.

there’s not much in the overall scope of what I do that. I would have to say that, but sometimes they bring in related areas that they think are related, but really aren’t and let’s face it we’re all in niches nowadays and while my niche can be fairly broad. There are some areas that I don’t focus on because the main reason I don’t focus on is the bulk of the work that I will get in.

Is in certain areas, and I want to make sure I’m really up on those and I’m focusing on those, because those type of things I can turn around real quick. 1 of the advantages of having a consultant. Who has all these years of experience, and I’m sure you can attest to this too. Is you also learn how to do things faster.

without sacrificing quality, because of the idea of practice [00:19:00] repetition application, you learn shortcuts over time as long as they don’t sacrifice the quality again. Part of the principles of my little firm and the principles of a lot of independent consultants out there is don’t bite off something that’s really not your forte and, you know, be be honest with your clients and, you know, focus on those things that you’re, you’re really good at.

Tim Melanson: Yeah, I think that that is really applicable to most people that they’ll get into a situation where a client will start to ask them questions about something. Maybe they’re kind of getting out of scope, right? On what they want. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I mean, if a client is looking for this, large solution with a bunch of things in it, Okay.

And you only do a portion of that, telling them that you can do the rest of it because you think you might lose the job is going to end up being more of a heartache for you, really, because now you’re going to be the one trying to figure all this stuff [00:20:00] out, and your margin is going to be totally lost.

You know, whereas if you were to just tell them, okay, well, this is the part that I can help you with. I think the example you just gave is my experience as well. Most cases, if not all, they kind of go back and go, Okay, no problem.

Scott Trumpolt: yeah,

Tim Melanson: and they come back and say, This is what I need rather than what you might have feared that they would be like, Okay, we’ll forget it.

I’ll find someone else that could do everything. Like you said, it’s very rare that they’re going to find it. A person that can be awesome at everything that they need. They need you to be specific and be an expert in one area. And they can need to go find experts in the other areas that they need as well, right?

Scott Trumpolt: Or there are situations where I have a very strong theoretical knowledge of something, but I haven’t applied it, or I have applied that knowledge to a client, but it’s not in the specific industry. Sometimes I can talk to them blue on the face in a nice way to a client that look, I know you’re in the [00:21:00] health care industry.

And the project that I did was for a different industry, but there are ways to, transfer most of this and then make it work for your business culture. But they might say, well, you have to have done this for exactly our kind of company. And so, again, you just be honest and you be transparent, but what we’re talking about here, these are good things to talk about, because these are some of the little roadblocks that you occur along the way.

But the vast majority of the time. every client I work with is a little bit different in terms of their needs. So, again, having all that experience, it allows for a broad range of solutions. And you just need to listen. You need to listen to what’s important to their company. I literally have companies that sometimes say to me, I know that the market says this and I agree with you, but we value that job more within our organization, or we [00:22:00] value that job less in our organization.

So, coming up with a solution, the knowing and so the things like. Learning about the business mission. And the corporate culture. And all of those things, that’s out of my own pocket. because I’m going to get paid when I do a really good job and this is that’s not exactly what they’re hiring for me.

That’s on me. That’s how I look at it.

Tim Melanson: I agree with that too. So let’s talk a little bit about the cash flow of it all. How do you, because I think this, hey, I didn’t learn how to balance a, a balance sheet when I was in school. I don’t know why we don’t learn these things, but, when you become a business owner, all of a sudden cashflow becomes a very, very important thing.

So how do you make sure that you’re keeping on the positive end of that?

Scott Trumpolt: Yeah, how I look at it is I size up a client. When I 1st, and this will lead directly to an answer to your question. Ash flow to [00:23:00] me is about. Repeat, sustain business. I know some competitors of mine, individual contributors. They may or may not be doing exactly what I do and what they focus on is getting that 1 big client.

That’s going to sustain them with cash flow for a long period. That’s not my business plan. That’s not my business model. My model is to go after companies. that will have. the potential for a lot of repeat business over time. So, what happens is, is that again, being a good listener. I do the initial project for the client, but when I do the initial project, I’m also thinking what else do they need.

To be just to support, and I discuss it with them during the course of that project at the right time. You know, everything has its time and its place. You know, but and what I found is that some clients again, in my particular expertise, they [00:24:00] don’t have an in house. So, it may be that I do the project for them.

And then I’m the 1 that does the maintenance for them. So, what I’m talking about here is that you really need to size up a client in terms of is this a 1 shot deal. Because I literally factor it into my pricing. If I see that a client has a lot of potential. To have a lot of repeat business, and I’ve had some clients that lasted multiple years with me.

Not all of them, but some of them, I will provide lower pricing. Because I like steady Eddie pay coming in on a monthly basis. So, it’s not all on a per project basis. Some of it is retainer. Some of it is just, hey, can you give me 20 hours a month to support this? And what happens is. While I’m searching for new clients, and I may not get new clients right away for 1 reason or another.

I’ve got the steady Eddie [00:25:00] 7 or 8, so I’ve got different, financial resources coming in of all different sizes. You know, some, it only may be a 1000 dollars a month, but another 1 might be 4000 dollars a month. You add it all up and that’s where you get your cash flow. So the best way that I can answer the question about keeping the cash flow going is.

You know, they say when you go in for a job interview to learn about the company. Well, when you’re investigating a client, I’m not saying don’t take the job because it’s only a 1 shot deal. And they’re very clear about that. Look, we don’t have any budget for anything long term. But ask the questions, get in there.

And see how things go and, of course, with everything you provide to them, you have to demonstrate to them. Why this is a value to them, you know, and so, I mean, that’s the thing with me. I fall into 1 of 3 categories either 1. they don’t have the expertise at all. 2, they have some [00:26:00] expertise in house, but they’re too busy doing all the paperwork that I was trying to get away from to become an independent consultant.

Or sometimes they have the expertise and, you know, they got the skill, but they don’t have enough of it in house. Sometimes they just need an extra hand. So, you know, you’re fitting into these companies have different resources. And, you know, everybody’s trying to get away with as few employees as possible,

I hear as a consultant is, aren’t you worried about the future?

You know, making sure money’s coming in. you don’t have that check coming in every week from that 1 employer. And my feeling has always been. That’s putting all your eggs in 1 basket at any moment in time. I’ve never been subject to that amazingly, but they can cut you off. Maybe you get a severance or something like that, but at least with me, I lose clients from time to time through no fault of my own.

I lose them and my money goes down, but I have [00:27:00] my steady Eddie’s and then maybe I add a client or 2 within a couple of months and I’m right back to where I was. So, have a little faith in yourself and just keep pushing yourself forward in terms of adversity, but I would rather have 7 or 8 streams of revenue coming in than 1.

Most people don’t believe that anymore, but they still think, well, I know I’m going to get. Paid twice a month on this day for this amount while I got this job.

Tim Melanson: They call it a steady paycheck. Yeah, I’ve said that same exact thing and I have been laid off twice. That’s the reason why I feel the same way as you do. I’d rather not have just one client. I’d rather have multiple and then I’ve got something to fall back on. Thanks so much, Scott.

Scott Trumpolt: Yeah. And for those people out there that may be watching or listening, think about it. You know, a lot of these independent consultants, you know, I’ve done 12 years. Some I’ve done 20 years or 25 years before it was even becoming the thing to do they’re doing on their [00:28:00] own. So there’s nothing unique here.

It’s just transparency, understanding that there’s so many people out there with so much. Knowledge that they’ve built up, they can do their own thing. If they already have the skill, they just need the will.

Tim Melanson: So tell me what’s exciting in your business.

Scott Trumpolt: What’s exciting in my business is. Always the next client, there’s 2 things that make me most excited the 2 things are 1, when I can move the needle, like I talked about earlier, I get some feedback from a client. That say, hey, this is well received and we’re getting some really good feedback, not just for management.

But from employees about their concerns about pay transparency, so, that that is a big thing. But the biggest thrill of all is getting a new client. any kind of new client, someone reaches out to you from 1 source or another and a [00:29:00] lot of my business.

is word of mouth. And people that have worked for me before, who know of me, or moved on to another location.

And the other thing is that even if you were referred by someone, you already knew once you’re working for that client, they become a referral for you in the future. So, it’s a self perpetuating cycle. So the thing that gets me most excited. Is landing some new clients if I can. And get a few new clients a year.

That’s wonderful. That’s really what makes me excited to push forward, to move forward, keep me engaged, because I got to be engaged first before I try and develop some project that will help engage others. Absolutely.

Tim Melanson: And it’s so cool to even hear this passion and excitement, you know, coming from you because that’s really when you think about it, if you’re hiring somebody to do a job for you or hiring a consultant, wouldn’t it be great if you got someone like you super excited to have you as a client and to be working for [00:30:00] you, you know, and loves what they do.

I mean, that’s what this is all about, isn’t it?

Scott Trumpolt: If you got to listen to your gut too, I think it’s very important to understand is that do you have the passion to do this? Because if you don’t, and you’re not really fully committed because You’re basically selling yourself now and you better believe in what you’re doing and passion properly controlled, I think is a wonderful thing.

Tim Melanson: Like I said, it, it moves mountains and your job becomes more of a hobby. Awesome. So now, if I was, like, how would you describe the, you know, most ideal person that would get the most out of working with you?

Scott Trumpolt: the most ideal person, would probably be because my background is human resources, albeit in the compensation space. The people that I would be ideal for [00:31:00] is where a company has said human resources department, you?

know, we got to find ways to. To engage our employees or the top management has complained about the wages within the organization.

Their 1st stop is going to be human resources and human resources is not likely going to have the tools. Because they’re not a profit center, they support the business, but they’re not a profit center. So getting money for human resources for projects like I do is difficult, but they reach out to me because I have very low overhead.

And so I’m, that’s where I come in. I’m the conduit. They’re not going to have to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to develop a system to do what they want to do. And they probably don’t have it on staff. Very rarely do I work with an internal person that is compensation, although companies do have them.

I came from that, but usually they’re general HR people that have a broad spectrum of [00:32:00] knowledge. And so I’m the specialist that comes in for a period of time. So that’s the ideal audience for me because I’m. Working through them, then through the company, I do meet the CEO. Oftentimes I do work with the business units, but still the closest connection is human resources.

They’re going to hear the bad news from the business about the morale of employees or not knowing the value, the market value of the jobs they’re paying and want to make sure they have adequate cost controls. So then HR needs to turn around and find someone that’s. reasonably price that can help them out.

Tim Melanson: So if that’s me, and, you know, I’m intrigued by this conversation, what’s the first step that I would take to find out a little bit more about you?

Scott Trumpolt: if that’s you and you were seeking someone out, the 1st thing I would say is, well, there are a couple of nice resources out there. The most you’re going to learn is by calling me and talking to me. [00:33:00] And emailing me with your questions, but having said that LinkedIn. Is a great source, I have a profile out there, bunch of information about myself, better business Bureau.

I’m going to credit a member of a better business Bureau. I know it’s very old fashioned, but. I believe in it, because what it says to clients is that. I back up my work, I’m not afraid to have some entity. Critique me, or to take criticisms of my work. And post them and so if someone goes out there, they can see testimonials.

better business Bureau of the Southeast Florida and the Caribbean, they can see testimonials of my work. And if it was someone like you. Who kind of already had an idea. Of what type of project they needed having done, they could look at these testimonials. Oh, he’s done that. Okay. He’s done that.

And I have a website www. HRcompensationconsulting. com that has a lot of information, including [00:34:00] the principles that I talked about, which are not words, just words to me. I live them and, you know, you can see the different clients that I work with and things like that.

I love that. So I’ll put all those links in the show notes so people can click on them if they want. hrcompensationconsulting. com. that’s my website, but again, LinkedIn, so many people are on LinkedIn and you can just see a little bit of my background. There’s a summary. Some other company did a profile on me. I threw that out there. I don’t have any. Testimonials out on LinkedIn, because about a year ago, I had a bugaboo where someone got into my LinkedIn profile and messed it up pretty bad.

So I’ve been rebuilding it. But, like I said, the better business Bureau. And again, giving out my email address [00:35:00] and my phone number as part of the information I sent to you, that’s what you’re welcome to share that with anybody who’s interested.

Tim Melanson: Well, thank you so much for rocking out with me today, Scott.

Scott Trumpolt: Thank you.

Tim Melanson: We’ll see you next time on the Work at Home Rockstar podcast, and you can go to workathomerockstar. com for more information.