Kirsten Graham – Building a Business Without Becoming the Bottleneck

Tim Melanson: [00:00:00] Hello, and welcome to today’s episode of the Work at Home Rockstar podcast. Very excited for today’s episode. We are talking to the CEO. She’s a business coach and outsourcing specialist for Six Figure Business Coaching, and what she does is she helps service-based entrepreneurs to simplify and scale their business by combining coaching, financial clarity, and strategic outsourcing.

Super excited to be talking to Kirsten Graham. Hey, Kirsten, you ready to rock?

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely, Tim. Thank you so much for having me today

Tim Melanson: That’s great. So we always start off with a good note. So tell me a story of success that we can be inspired by

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely. So my background is real estate. I sold real estate, I moved to the mortgage side, I went on to own a mortgage company and a title company. And while I did a lot of loans for self-employed people, I would see their business tax returns and their personal tax returns, and then they would always take me to lunch to pick my brain.

So I mentored business owners for about a decade, and then I decided to start taking paid c- coaching clients. And the reason why I wanted to share that story with [00:01:00] your audience today is because sometimes you’re doing something at your job that could end up turning into a business. So always keep your eyes open for that opportunity, because I thought I would live and die in the real estate industry.

I had zero thought. Like, I, I never … the thought never crossed my mind to become a business coach. And because I just mentored people and helped them whenever I could, it eventually turned into a paid business, and that was really exciting because in … You know, we survived 2008, which wasn’t easy. We got beat up quite badly.

But, you know, my mom was terminally ill in 2013, and at that point, I’d taken on enough coaching clients that I was able to say, "I’m finished, um, with the mortgage industry and I wanna spend the next six months or eight months or however long she has with her." And because I’d already taken on those coaching clients, I was able to do that, and that

But it led me down a totally different path and [00:02:00] I’m very excited that I, you know, took the step to move forward, even though I had a business, actually kind of taking on a second business, which was the coaching, because it just made sense. So for all of you out there that maybe you’re, you’re still working a job and you wanna work for yourself, you have skills that you’ve developed in your career and you probably have people asking you for help.

There’s a way to turn that into a business

Tim Melanson: Yeah, I’m really glad you mentioned that ’cause that, that is something that, uh, I mean, we all have something that someone picks our brains about, right? And, and the funny thing about it is that you were doing it for free ’cause you like doing it, you like helping people, and, and that’s the… You know what?

We, we talk about that quite a bit on the, on the podcast, especially when it comes to, like, music and stuff ’cause I think people have a hard time charging money for the thing that they like to do for free.

Kirsten Graham: Yes.

Tim Melanson: Do you find that? Is that a weird thing that we have?

Kirsten Graham: No, no, because it comes so naturally to you that you forget that it’s a challenge for someone else. So you know, for example, a lot of [00:03:00] business owners, they, they don’t enjoy bookkeeping, but it’s hard for us to imagine that there are people who actually that’s their jam. They love doing that, right?

Or if we hate things like technology and video editing and stuff like that, it’s hard to imagine because it’s not our unique ability, it doesn’t come easy to us, sometimes it’s hard to imagine that other people actually love doing that. And it’s… For us, when something comes easy for us, we sometimes think, "Well, why would anybody pay me for this?

It’s so easy. Can’t everybody do this?" And that’s not the case

Tim Melanson: Yeah, exactly. And, and the, the, I think there are certain things that everybody knows is not easy for every- for everybody else, like the math stuff. You can be like, "Yeah, okay, I get it. Not everybody likes that." But there might be something in your business that you are, just think is very easy, like you just said, but isn’t obvious that it’s not, it’s not easy for everybody, right?

Um, and, and that’s the, that’s the gold right there, ’cause that’s the thing that people are happy to pay for ’cause they just don’t wanna do it, right?

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, so if you’re thinking about, [00:04:00] just start tracking when people ask you questions. You know, what are they asking you about? What do people come to you for? Because you’re kind of an expert in it, not that you call yourself that. You know, it’s just friends or family or people you know, clients or they come to you and ask you certain things.

And if you find out that that is a unique ability, then do some research and figure out could you turn that into a business and would you enjoy doing that as a business? Or maybe you already have a business, but you haven’t thought about bringing that element into it

Tim Melanson: Yeah. Well, we can get back into that a little bit later. Uh, but before we do, let’s talk a little bit about the bad note. So what is something… Hey, not everything goes as planned, right? There are some certain things that don’t go as planned, and that seems to be the thing that keeps people out of it, out of the game.

They’re thinking, "Ah, you know, it’s not gonna work out the way I want it to. What if I fail?" I, I’d just like to talk about it because we all get those things, and we’re still here, right? So it can still work out for you even though you make mistakes. So I’m wondering, can you share with me one of those mistakes?

Kirsten Graham: Sure, sure. So one of my clients from [00:05:00] my mortgage company was Jeannie Wilson, who’s now my business partner, and she was one of those people that I mentored. And she was at the time building an agency, so this is back… I’m gonna age us really quickly. This is back when Facebook first had fan pages.

Tim Melanson: Oh.

Kirsten Graham: And, you know, at this point local businesses had websites resistantly, but they, they knew nothing about LinkedIn or they thought it was a resume site or email marketing or blogging.

Those things were very prevalent online, but not within local businesses. And so she was starting a digital marketing agency, so you’re kind of swimming upstream because people don’t really know what you’re doing.

Tim Melanson: Mm-hmm.

Kirsten Graham: so she ended up hosting some classes that taught people about, you know, how to use LinkedIn for business and networking.

You know, what, why should you blog? Why should you add a blog to your website at least once a month, ideally every week? Um, email marketing. What is email marketing and how do you use it? So she hosted some classes, filled the classes because people were interested, but what happened next was she ended up getting really busy really fast.[00:06:00]

And so I said to her, "I’ve read about outsourcing overseas. Would you like to try this?" And I still have my mortgage company, and I’ve got a huge team, uh, all in the States, but we decided to start outsourcing for her digital marketing agency. And she said, "I’ll do it if you’ll help me." So this is before Zoom.

It’s before WhatsApp. I mean, this was back, very old school. And so we kind of found everything we could research to find on outsourcing, and we went down that, that road of helping her hire website, um, developers, people who could create profiles on LinkedIn and fan, Facebook fan pages because business owners didn’t even wanna create their own profiles back then.

Or could blog or set up the blogs once she had written them and things like that. I like to say we’re either we’re stubborn a- and stupid probably in a lot of ways because it went wrong, it went wrong. I mean, it, it went wrong every way it could go wrong. So we had, you know, you have people that don’t show up and do a good job with the project or [00:07:00] you learn that you’ve hired the wrong person because they weren’t honest about the skills that they had.

You know, or one person’s been working for you a while and asked, "Hey, I’ve had a family emergency. Could you pay me early?" And that happened, and then he vanished, right? So it was definitely a learning curve, and we kind of joke looking back that it’s surprising that we stuck with it. But it was one of those things where no one else that we knew was doing it, so we didn’t really have anyone to go to to ask questions.

So it really was white-knuckling it and figuring it out. But Jeanne went on to build a successful digital marketing agency with that process, and then we went on to partner to help other people learn how to outsource, um, because we just realized it can change, it can change a person’s business when you get the support in your business you need.

But it, it, yeah, if, if you think you’re gonna start a business and everything’s gonna be easy, it’s not, right? But sometimes you just have to realize that even though you don’t have a skill right now, you can develop that skill. You [00:08:00] know, as far as interviewing goes, like m- myself and our team, we have it dialed in.

We very seldom have a bad hire anymore, and I will have to say until, um, the pandemic. And what happened was we had… I guess there were people teaching r- people in the Philippines or in India how to become virtual assistants, like how to interview to be a virtual assistant. Not know how to do the skills, but how to interview for the job.

And so we got caught with two, two bad hires, and I was like, "How the heck did this happen?" Like, we haven’t had a bad hire in years. And, um, so I was finally able to talk with one of them and like you said, these were the skills you had. You know, so I was able to get out of that person that they had gone through a program that taught them, told them how to interview,

Tim Melanson: Wow

Kirsten Graham: right?

Yeah. And so, so that was a… Again, it’s always a learning curve. I don’t think… That’s the other thing that’s exciting about owning your own business is every day things are evolving and changing, and you’re always learning. And just have faith that you have the ability to learn new [00:09:00] things and to do hard things.

Um, and at the, at the end, it always pays off.

Tim Melanson: Yeah. It does pay off if you stick with it, right? And sometimes if you have some help, right?

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely

Tim Melanson: But I mean, that, that’s the thing is that, is that like you say, that you, you’re gonna learn. I mean, they, all these things are gonna happen, and then you’re gonna, you’re gonna move forward. And a- I mean, what’s the other alternative?

You’re, you’re, you’re sitting in a company maybe that you’re not super excited about. I know the thing that, that I dreaded the most about going to a job was just not having that control and that excitement. And I know for me, like, those problems and those things that don’t go well, yes, they suck at the time, but they’re exciting when you figure them out, right?

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely. And I love the joke that, um, an entrepreneur is the only person that will quit a 40-hour a week job to work 80 hours a week for themselves.

Tim Melanson: Yes

Kirsten Graham: Because you just don’t… When you start your business, you don’t think about that window of time that you spend [00:10:00] learning new things. You know, especially like right now we’ve got AI on the scene, you know, and that’s the past five or six years with that has been amazing, but you’re still in a constant learning mode.

So it, it is a matter of understanding that if you love to learn and you’re excited about learning, then s- working for yourself is definitely the way to go.

Tim Melanson: Yeah, I think it, like, I think when it comes down to it, like, if you’re the type of person that is very prideful about the work that you’re putting out there, like you want it to be really good and y- you wanna do a great job, a- that to me, and I- it’s just maybe my experience, in a corporate setting, you’re getting paid the same as the guy sitting right next to you that is doing hardly anything.

So I mean, if you’re the type of person that just like, "I just need to get this done right," you’re not gonna succeed in a, in a corporate environment. It’s, it’s gonna be very, very difficult. But now all, all of a sudden if you’re working for yourself, well, now the better you get at what you do, the more you can deliver within the same amount of [00:11:00] time, the more money you make.

Now you can take on another client, right? So it’s, it- it’s just a, a personality thing, I think, and I think a lot of people don’t, um, they, they, they wanna clock in, clock out, and they just wanna, you know, be there and do that thing and not have a bunch, a bunch of stress. Well, that’s probably not gonna work out so well if you’re self-employed, right?

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, no. Yeah, uh, uh, you know, I, I, like you, believe that h- owning your own business is, is amazing. But I do accept that there are some people who enjoy being in corporate America. They enjoy that climbing that corporate ladder. Because there are, on the flip side of this with working from home, it can be isolating and you can feel alone at times, and sometimes it can be challenging to figure out things on your own, which why- is why I think it’s so important to build community of other entrepreneurs that you have somebody to bounce things off of.

But yeah, if you’re that type of person who loves challenges, wants to make more money for what you’re doing, and just, you know, you wanna help other people… I think that’s the other thing. People who are self-employed, they have a huge desire [00:12:00] to help people. And I think sometimes in a corporation you don’t always get to see the, the ultimate outcome of what you do and how it affects someone.

But when you’re self-employed, you do

Tim Melanson: Yeah, I could tell you a bunch of stories about that, but we don’t have time. But, uh, but, uh, the other thing about it too is that, I mean, hey, the, we could talk about the band, we could take that in so many different directions. Uh, one of those directions just to start off here would be that, um, i- if, if you’re the person that is the, the entrepreneur, you’re the person that likes to fix all these problems and all that stuff, it’s also super helpful to have somebody on your team that is not that person, that just wants to be, uh, you know, have really clear direction and they, uh, need to know what they, what they’re doing that day.

You know, that can be the st- the person in your band. You know, they don’t have to be working for a multinational company. They could be working for a small business like you and me and, and, and getting what they want, you know, in, in that kind of atmosphere, right?

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely. Yeah. I think the people who are willing to work for smaller companies in the States, you know, I have lots of great people who work for my [00:13:00] mortgage company and my title company. You know, those people contribute so much to the success of the business. They contribute so much to the community.

Um, yeah, so a lot of people would rather be part of a smaller business and see it grow and be a part of that growth and have, again, see the tangible results of what they’re doing rather than sometimes being in a very large corporation

Tim Melanson: That’s, and that’s true too, yeah. You, you’re more likely to see, you know, the full scale of what you’re doing in a sm- in a small company than you are in a big company. I used to work in a very big company, and like you said, I, I did not … I, I was on this little, little piece of this puzzle, and I never, I never saw what it was doing, right?

And

Kirsten Graham: the full picture

Tim Melanson: yeah, and, and that can be … I, I don’t know. I, I guess, like, like we’re saying, I mean, everybody’s different, but for me it was demoralizing in a way. Uh, you know, it was just like I, I like to see what my work is doing. Like, I like to see somebody that says, "Great job," and, "This really helped me." Like, I … It, it, it works for me, right?

Kirsten Graham: Yes. Yes[00:14:00]

Tim Melanson: So, um, now let’s talk a little bit about … Okay, so when you mentioned earlier, you know, I mean, you were doing some business coaching on the side. So yeah, um, for me, my bes- first business was basically tech support, fixing computers. Because as I was working for my programming company, I loved fixing problems and troubleshooting things.

"Hey, my computer’s acting weird," and I would love doing that, and so that ended up being my first job. Um, or, sorry, first business. Figuring out how to price it though, and figuring out how to, like, that was really difficult. Do you have any tips on how to make sure that you’re making enough money? Like, should you just charge your hourly rate that you work at your company?

Like, how does all that work?

Kirsten Graham: Sure. Yeah, so w- because we, we, we specialize in virtual assistants, and one of the types of virtual assistants we specialize in are bookkeeping VAs, um, because it’s a lot more affordable than hiring someone locally, and I hire bookkeepers for large CPA firms and larger bookkeeping companies. So they’re already outsourcing it, so [00:15:00] we’re, we’re kind of brought that concept to the small business owner who needs the most support but doesn’t necessarily think they can afford it.

So I would say what I find with people who finally get their bookkeeping in order, um, they start to realize their pricing doesn’t work. So you need to have a structure or a strategy around pricing, but a lot of times, you know, you wanna help someone, so you wanna make sure the price is affordable, or you really need that sale, so you want it to be affordable.

But I think the number one thing that helps people to build successful businesses is a solid financial foundation, and that comes from having your bookkeeping up to date, reviewing your profit and loss statement with your bookkeeper each month, understanding your cashflow, because that’s one of the things we see all the time.

When people get that in order, the first thing they say is, "Oh my gosh, I am undercharging," or, "I cannot afford to even offer this service anymore because I can’t charge what it would be worth."

Tim Melanson: Yeah

Kirsten Graham: So when you really understand your financials, you know, you have that CFO hat on, it makes pricing your [00:16:00] offers a lot easier

Tim Melanson: Yeah. Well, because it’s, uh, I, back to the, just the way that we think, right? I mean, you look at this hourly rate and you’re thinking, "Okay, well, my job I was making, you know, X amount of dollars per hour." So, you know, y- you feel like if you’re charging double or triple that, that you’re ripping someone, uh, somebody off.

But, but the thing is, is that there’s a lot of things in your business, I, I remember talking about this, y- you know, you, y- y- you, you, you, you start your own business because, "Oh, I’m really good at this thing, so I’m gonna start charging for that." And then you realize that you spend, like, what? 20% of your time doing that thing, and there’s, like, all this other stuff you have to do to run your business.

That has to get charged out, too, right? So you have to work that in to, to the whole, to the whole puzzle. And, and how do you do that, right?

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, I think the main thing, again, it’s gonna go back to understanding your financials. And, you know, if you started a business and you didn’t necessarily have a ton of accounting classes, or you’re a very creative person and you feel like, you know, math isn’t your thing,

Tim Melanson: Yeah[00:17:00]

Kirsten Graham: understand that… A- and I do get this because, you know, I’ve had so many people tell me that their CPA talked down to them, or every time they asked a question they were made to feel stupid, or, you know, th- they, they hired a bookkeeper, but they couldn’t afford it any longer.

So because there’s just this really, there’s a lot of shame and guilt around money, and a lot of stress around money, but that’s the number one thing I think you have to master, and realize you don’t have to do it alone. Like I said, there are people out there, crazy people out there that love bookkeeping.

Like, that’s their jam, that’s their superpower. So learning to lean into people who have skills that you don’t always have, because someone can help you really understand your numbers, and that person can really help you make good decisions. So whether, again, it’s around pricing or looking at some of the things that you’re doing.

Does it make more sense to outsource this so that I can work with more clients? It’s all a numbers game, right? Whether it’s sales or pricing. But a- again, for a lot of people, there can be shame, [00:18:00] guilt, stress around money, and that, I think that’s the biggest challenge. I don’t think it’s always… I think some of it’s on more on a subconscious level, and yet you do forget all the things that you have to do to keep the business running, not just getting paid for the hours that you’re actually working.

And which is a different con-

Tim Melanson: Well, I mean, on that note, I mean, it, it’s just a sort of an observation that I’ve noticed is that the, the, the accounting, the money, the numbers, the, even the tech support, all those things are very left brain, and they’re very, like, non-emotional. And the people that tend… I mean, you, you, you see the movies, right?

The tech guy. He tends to be a total jerk, like talking down to you about, "Oh, it’s just so stupid." And, and, and based on what you te- said earlier, I mean, to them it’s easy, so they can’t understand how you can’t understand. It’s just numbers, right? That kind of thing. And so they tend to talk down to you.

Like, and, and, I mean, a bad teacher in, in, in school can really affect how you think about a topic. And like you said, I do think that that’s true, that a lot [00:19:00] of the reason why we don’t like math or we don’t like numbers is because of the arrogant person that taught it to us in the first place and made us feel stupid for not understanding it immediately, right?

Kirsten Graham: Well, and when I look at y- y- it all goes back to math. So let’s say in the example of the bookkeepers, our bookkeeping virtual assistants are $9 an hour. They work directly with the client. You have to ask yourself, if you’ve got this pile of receipts, and you’ve got all of this stuff that needs to be done, and you’re not really sure where your money’s going, and you’re not really sure how you should price your services, then that’s eating away at your confidence.

It’s causing you a lot of stress and anxiety. And as an entrepreneur, you need to be confident. Not arrogant, but confident. But if you aren’t doing things in your business that you know you should be doing, it erodes your confidence. So being able to have someone do that for you at a very affordable rate…

So my question is, if you paid someone $6 an hour or $9 an hour to do something else for you, could you free up time and go make more money? And that’s [00:20:00] the power of outsourcing that people don’t see. You’re, you’re spending money at a very, very cost-effective rate to be able to go and bill your hourly rate working with more clients or improving things in your business that can make you more money in the long term, whether it’s rolling out a new product or service.

So that’s, that’s also something that I think the people who need the help the most, they overlook that because maybe they think they can’t afford it,

Tim Melanson: Yeah

Kirsten Graham: or they, or they feel like they’re not… Because I don’t know how to do my own bookkeeping or whatever it is we’re talking about, they feel like they can’t outsource it.

And so that’s, that’s a challenge. But your time is your most valuable asset as an entrepreneur, your time. You can make more money. You could lose it all today and make more tomorrow, right? But if you don’t value your time and find, one, systems and processes, two, get the support you deserve in your business by hiring people to do the things you don’t like to do or that you’ve just run out of time to do, then you’re, you’re trapping your…

You’re, you’ve created your [00:21:00] own glass ceiling. You know, in corporate, it’s like they hit the glass ceiling. A lot of entrepreneurs, they build their own glass ceiling

Tim Melanson: Yeah, yeah. Well, I think a- an- another block too, ’cause I, I think that there is the, you know, "I can’t afford it, I can’t afford to outsource," uh, but also there’s probably a lot of even embarrassment of, like, letting somebody see how bad you are with money type of thing, right? And you might be like, "Okay, well how do I trust this person to come into my business for $9 an hour," like you say, "and they’re gonna magically do all this stuff that I can’t figure out myself?"

Like, I, I think there might be this, like, little circular pattern going on. Like, h- how do you get somebody to let you in, right, to that area?

Kirsten Graham: Okay, right. So yeah, so Tim, what we’ve done is we’re not an outsourcing agency, so we provide a program. So I’m not, I’m not trying to sell you guys, but I’m telling you how, how this

Tim Melanson: Yeah

Kirsten Graham: because exactly what you said. So people come into our program, we teach them about the different types of bookkeeping software.

We teach them cultural differences, what it’s like to [00:22:00] manage someone and lead tasks for someone overseas. We talk to them about security, all the things that they wanna know. Write-offs. So many small businesses are leaving money on the table because they don’t know all the things that they can write off.

So we go through this in a very, um, easy digestible way, and then when the client is ready, they pick their software, they fill out a form, and then we pair them with a bookkeeper that we’ve already interviewed and vetted, and there’s… They’ve gone through our success training portal, so they’re, they’re awesome.

We pair them, and now that bookkeeper works directly for that client, and that client pays that bookkeeper directly because we really wanna empower people to start to build their team. And in most cases, most smaller businesses don’t usually have more to, more than three to five hours of bookkeeping a month.

Um, once they’re caught up, we’ve had a lot of clients that have been behind two or three years in bookkeeping, and we, we say we’re a no judgment zone, right? So that bookkeeper doesn’t care if they’re going back and cleaning up two years of, of bookkeeping for you, or they’re starting fresh today. [00:23:00] They have zero emotion to it.

They’re just gonna get in there and do their job, and they’re gonna do it well so that you don’t have to stress over it. So yeah, that can be a challenge, is figuring out how to hire the right person, which is why we do the things the way we do them. But again, when it comes to outsourcing, it, it’s… Even hiring someone locally I think can be challenging, right?

Because again, it’s the same thing, and there’s lots of awesome, wonderful local bookkeepers. Um, but again, at that, we have had a couple people that have said, you know, it is less embarrassing to be working with someone halfway around the world than maybe working with someone that you might see out networking.

I, I get that, too.

Tim Melanson: does make sense. Yeah, if you see them a- around or if you end up finding out that they’re friends with your friends, right? You’re like, "Ugh, this is awkward." Yeah

Kirsten Graham: So I think outsourcing took away a little bit of that, which was awesome. But, you know, it’s so funny to see people, once they really, you know, have their monthly meeting with their bookkeeping VA and they see that they [00:24:00] can start a- they can ask questions and they’re not made to feel stupid.

You know, it might take them six months before they fully understand their profit and loss statement, but that’s okay. In six months they know something that they didn’t know now, and they’ve got a whole new skill set. They’ve got a whole new vocabulary when it comes to talking to their CPA. So yeah, it, it’s just empowering people to understand that there are lots of different ways to do things, but outsourcing is one of the things that there’s multiple ways.

You could hire yourself, you could go through an outsourcing agency, you could work with someone like us. But there are lots of tools and availa- of people available to help you

Tim Melanson: Yeah. Well, let’s talk a little bit about the tools then. So what tools or, you know, instruments do you use in your business to get success?

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, so we’re huge fans of, of GoHighLevel. I don’t know if you’re familiar with

Tim Melanson: Yep.

Kirsten Graham: So we started using that years ago, and it was a funny story because Jeannie and I kept looking at it. It looked too good to be true, ’cause we were spending so much money, and we had all these other softwares and they didn’t talk to each other.

And we [00:25:00] actually ended up getting on a call with Sean, one of the owners, and we actually talked to him about the software, and then we ended up meeting with him again because we wanted to know, like, "What’s your intention? What’s your intention with our daughter? What’s your intention with this software?

Do you plan on building it and then just selling it to HubSpot or somebody that’s gonna s- you know, just squash it?" And we really believe that he was committed to keeping the software, so we moved everything over. This was back before it was easy to do, so it took us, like, six months to move all of our funnels and all the things.

But once we got up and running on that, we fell in love with it. So that is one of our primary tools. We actually went on to white label a version of HighLevel, and we also have software virtual assistants. Because I feel like a tool for people is, like, the foundation of how you grow your business. So definitely having a great CRM, having structure to help you manage your time is really important, and being able to manage con- connecting with your, with your prospects and your clients is, is very important.

The other thing we use is we use Trello a lot. We have a large team, so we lean into Trello for managing tasks. [00:26:00] We believe you lead people and you manage task, and so that’s where project management software… Trello’s free to use. If you haven’t used it, there’s lots of great videos on, on YouTube to watch, but it’s a great tool to help you manage projects.

One of the ways that Jeannie and I use it as a partnership is we have, like, a 2026, and we have Q1, January, February, March. We have Q2. So we have it lined out, because as business owners, we can get really excited about something. You know, we kinda have shiny object syndrome.

Tim Melanson: Yeah

Kirsten Graham: So if we, if something, an opportunity or something comes along the way and we’re like, "Oh my gosh, this could be so cool to do," we create a card on our board, and then we look at our calendar and we think, "Well, where will we actually be able to do it?

We can’t do it in March ’cause this is already booked. Let’s put it in the Q2 column, and then when we have our Q2 meeting, we’ll review all the things that are there and decide what we wanna take action on next." And sometimes by the time we get to it, it doesn’t seem as exciting as it did in the moment.

So sometimes those things fall away. And that’s the other thing is, again, [00:27:00] managing time and energy is really important, and by not always jumping on opportunities, like really thinking them through, and making sure you’re planning your, your marketing, you’re planning things out so that you’re not, again, chasing every shiny object out there is gonna help you be more successful.

So Trello we love. Um, we use Zoom a lot obviously. Podcasting, meeting with our team, Zoom’s definitely one of the tools we use. AI is amazing. We started using AI back when Jasper came out, which was a few years before Chat kind of hit the market. So having something to help you write, having something to help you, you know, create documents and things like that is fantastic.

Just remember, it’s not always accurate, so you need to check behind it, yeah? And, um, and, and really as a business owner, everything you put out represents you, so you wanna make sure that you’re not putting out what they refer to as AI slop, and there’s some good rules around that. So just making sure that you’re using AI responsibly and what you’re putting out there [00:28:00] truly represents who you are as a business owner.

I would say those are the primary right now

Tim Melanson: Nice. I wanna, I wanna poi- uh, like, zero in on something you just said, ’cause it’s not, it’s, it has not come up on this podcast in, like, 400 episodes. And it was about how when you come up with an idea, you just create a card for it and look at it later. That is brilliant, because the shiny object syndrome is a big thing for all of us.

I’ve been in, you know, I, I come up with this idea, and I end up, like, working on it for, like, hours, and then the next day I’m like, "That’s not even a good idea." Like, like, what, what’s up with that? It’s almost like you, you finish it. And what a great idea to just write it down, because you don’t wanna lose it, ’cause it could be a good idea.

But, but it’s like the next day if it’s still a good idea, or the next quarter, whatever it happens to be, that’s the right time, ’cause it, ’cause it’s like it stands the test of time, right? But that, that’s brilliant, really, to just write it down right away [00:29:00] so you don’t forget it, but put it over there so that if it’s still a good idea at that point…

Because that’s the thing, you, you’ve gotta be intention about your day. Like, if you’ve, if you’ve planned to work on these five things today and then you drop them because this shiny idea came into play, well, now you’re not doing the things that you thought was important when you were thinking about it, right?

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely. The other thing you can do is, you, you know, we don’t really, I say, work on Fridays. As a general rule, we don’t take meetings on Fridays, which means we have the opportunity to, to get shit done, let’s be honest. Sometimes to catch up for everything we’re behind on. But, um, that is a time when Jeanne and I will talk out ideas that we’ve had, and we’ll make notes in those cards.

You know, so, you know, putting as much information in the card as possible is important. So for example, I was talking about creating a quiz for a lead magnet, and the timing’s not right, but I d- I did end up getting some information from it last Friday, ’cause that’s some time to… That’s my time to kind of go down a rabbit hole if I want to, a couple hours on [00:30:00] Fri- And so I went down the rabbit hole, pulled a bunch of information, and then I just put it all in the card.

So when we come back to it, you know, in Q2, and we decide if it makes sense to create a quiz funnel, all of my notes and my thoughts are there, so then we have the opportunity to review what we talked about and then have a conversation around it and to develop it into something that might actually be really amazing or viable.

So that, that’s how we, we process that

Tim Melanson: Nice. Yeah. And, uh, I mean, you mentioned AI. I mean, I, I- it comes up on almost every, every podcast now. Uh, b- but I, I use AI a lot for that as well because, I mean, y- you can talk out these ideas. I, I know that it’s always more effective to talk it out with somebody, right? I mean, you’re, you know, you sit in your own head, but, like, uh, but talking it out with an AI is fantastic ’cause you get to work through some of those things, and then it can actually summarize everything and help you put it into the card so that you can r- revisit it later.

Do you use it for that too, or?

Kirsten Graham: We do, yeah. So, [00:31:00] yeah, actually asking it different questions and fleshing out how it would work and, you know, just, just remember, especially Chat, Chat, like, wants to tell you what you wanna know. So

Tim Melanson: It wants to tell you what you wa- what you wanna hear.

Kirsten Graham: everything you say, even if you tell it not to. So we use Claude, we use, um, we use probably four or five different AI tools, and I flip around between them.

I might take everything Chat gave me and put it in Claude and said, "What’s wrong with this?" Pick holes in this. Find … Yeah. So I’m kind of… I’m pitting them against each other, you know? And we joke because Judy says please and thank you to her AI. I, I, I’m like, "You didn’t do that right. That’s not what I wanted.

Get it right." And so we joke that, you know, when AI comes to take over the world, she’s being nice to them so they’ll be nice to her. I’m like, "Oh, no, I’m letting them know we’re gonna have a fight. If they come to take over, we’re having a fight."

Tim Melanson: Yeah. Wow

Kirsten Graham: But yeah, you can use different AI tools to cross-reference what other AI tools have done, so

Tim Melanson: Yeah. But I, you know, to me, that’s encouraging that it makes all those mistakes because you know, people are, like, all scared that [00:32:00] it’s gonna take over everything, and I just don’t think it’s going to. It’s ju- um, but I’m, I’m a programmer, so I see it as code. And, and, and code is not a person. So it’s, it’s very good with the left brain stuff, but the right brain stuff, I think it’s always gonna need us for that, right?

Kirsten Graham: Yes, absolutely

Tim Melanson: Yeah. But, but a l- the, the, the funny thing about it is that the left brain stuff is the stuff that’s super time-consuming and monotonous. It’s, it’s the stuff that most of us don’t wanna do anyway. So why not use, uh, a tool to help us with that portion of things so that we can spend more time in our right brain doing the creative things that actually do light us up, right?

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, absolutely. And, and like you said, AI isn’t… It’s getting there. I mean, it’s changing so rapidly. But for example, like I said, I place bookkeepers for CPA firms and s- and bookkeeping companies, and a couple of the bookkeeping companies have been taking on different AI tools that is supposed to do some of the work for them, but they’re like, "It’s not there yet.

You have to go through and, and, and really sign off on what it’s done." So by the time you review it, you almost could have done it. [00:33:00] And so a, a couple of them have said, "We’ll just, we’ll table it for another year till they get it right and just, you know, use our VAs to do that." The, uh, another thing that people ask is do I feel like AI will replace virtual assistants, and I don’t think so because I feel like AI is a tool that can assist the virtual assistants in their job.

You know, our VAs are trained to use different AI tools, and we give them support on learning about AI. So I, I don’t really think people are gonna be completely replaced, but it is gonna take, like you said, a lot of the monotonous things away, which is gonna allow us to ask our team, "Hey, you know, that used to take you 10 hours.

Now with AI, it takes you two. What do you wanna do with those other eight hours?" Like, you know, "Is there a project that you see that we could work on?" Or, you know, Jeanne and I might decide this is the next project, so this is what we want you to do for this. So I, it’s, I think it’s a great tool, but it is a tool.

Tim Melanson: Yeah. Uh, you and I agree on that. I, I said the same thing. I, I don’t think it’s gonna replace hardly anything. It’s just gonna make the people that we’re hiring more effective. ‘Cause I do see it as a hammer, and y- y- I mean, if, [00:34:00] if, if I’m hiring somebody, I need to hire somebody to use the hammer, right? And unless I’m using the hammer, and then I’m my own virtual assistant, which I’m not.

I don’t, I don’t wanna be my own virtual assistant. I want somebody else to handle that portion. So give them the hammer. They can do it. I’ll hire them to do it. Now, will that make me pay a lot less or, or have a much more effective VA? Probably. I think it’s actually going to, like, really dial that up. I mean, hey, I mean, a virtual assistant now might only be able to handle one or two or three clients or whatever it is, but man, give that a few years, and they will be able to actually up-level their own business to be able to handle so much more, ’cause they’re an expert in that area and they know how to use the tool.

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, absolutely

Tim Melanson: You know? It, it- to me, what’s, what’s the most exciting about AI, I think, is the way I see the future, is I think that it’s gonna make everybody significantly more productive. And to me, that means more small businesses. [00:35:00] That means more people work from home and doing these things, right? And, and being able to compete with large, large businesses.

So I, I think it’s, I think it’s exciting. But I mean, hey, I’m an optimist.

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, it, yeah, it, it’s funny too because I, in my whole life I’ve never thought, "Oh, I’d love to be 20 again," until it came out and I thought, "Oh my gosh, I would love to be 20 again because I want to see where this is gonna go over the next 80 years," right? So but like someone said, 20 years is gonna happen in like two years based on AI ’cause things are getting compressed.

But yeah, we do have to figure out how to set aside time to learn AI, and like you said, not let it re- derail the day of the tasks that you need to get done

Tim Melanson: Yeah. And I’ve gotten into pretty big arguments with AI too, so don’t let it ruin your day. Like,

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, that

Tim Melanson: it’s not a person, it doesn’t get it, so you can yell at it all you want and it just doesn’t get it, right?

Kirsten Graham: exactly

Tim Melanson: So let’s move into your solo. Tell me what’s exciting in your business right now

Kirsten Graham: Oh my [00:36:00] gosh. So in the past, all of the virtual assistants we have offered have really revolved around marketing, so because Jeanne owned an agency, so we offer virtual assistants for clients who wanna start a video podcast or virtual assistants for people who want to get booked on podcast. Or like I said, we offer software virtual assistants for building funnels and, and websites and things like that.

So everything we have done has really been geared around marketing. In 2025, our bookkeeper retired, and she sold her business, and because I’ve already been hiring bookkeepers, you know, for other companies, Jeanne and I decided to outsource it. And we knew we’d save money. We saved about $3,600 a year. But what happened was it changed the relationship because, again, business to business is one thing, but having a virtual assistant who’s on your team that you’re paying hourly…

And again, even though our bookkeeper works, like, four hours a month for us, she’s still on our team. It changed some things because in our second meeting, one of the things she asked us was, "You have a lot of [00:37:00] different revenue streams. Would you like me to separate those?" And we’re like, "Yeah, that’s a great idea."

Our past bookkeeper never asked us, but we never asked her. It was something that we didn’t even think about. But breaking down the income streams gave us a lot of information. It was interesting to see, you know, one, we were bringing in more affiliate commission than we realized. You know, it was interesting to see which offers had been more profitable.

It was interesting to see where we needed to raise some prices. So that was really powerful. And somehow we started talking about that, and then someone said, "Are you gonna offer bookkeeping virtual assistance?" And we had kind of said we weren’t gonna roll out anything else new until 2026, but we did roll it out in 2025.

But, but yeah, it just… Yeah, we had a, we had a big enough demand for it. So we ended up creating, um, it’s called Love Your Profit, and it’s a program that helps our clients get their finances in order with a bookkeeping, a, a bookkeeper, affordable bookkeeping virtual assistant. And my heart was singing because, again, my background’s mortgage, and so I’m back in the numbers, so that was really [00:38:00] exciting for me.

And at the end of 2025, I just said to Jeanne, you know, as a business coach over, you know, the past couple decades, one of the things I’ve realized is the business owners that have their finances in order are always the ones that are more successful. And the people who, you know, they might… Uh, there are a lot of people who will take manifesting classes, like money manifesting classes, but that’s not gonna work if you’re afraid of your money and you’re sticking your head in the sand and your bookkeeping’s not getting done, right?

And so we were like, okay, well, this is people who I really wanna help, the people who have a lot of guilt, a lot of shame around money. I want to really empower them to build a successful financial foundation. So our mission for 2026 is to help 1,000 business owners to get their finances in order and, uh, pair them with fabulous, um, bookkeeping virtual assistants, and it was a big goal.

So I, I always said I- I’m a little bit scared to put it out there because I have no idea how we’re gonna make this happen. But we’ve had an opportunity, two different, um, creators that have [00:39:00] fairly large audiences have invited us to come into their marketplaces or to speak with their people. So it’s, it’s starting to fall in place.

You know, here we are with, uh… We’re recording this on the 3rd of March. Um, so we’re not cl- we’re not, we’re not on track to hit that thousand right now, I’ll be honest. Like, and that’s the other thing, being honest, right? So you have a big goal, and you know, well, I need to sell this many a month in order for it to work.

We’re behind on that right now, but we’ve been really doing the foundational work to build relationships of people who also have our ideal client and who believe and know that if they change that one thing in their business, it’ll boost their confidence. It’ll change their pricing. It’ll, it’ll help them become successful.

So that’s, that’s what I’m most excited about.

Tim Melanson: Wow, that’s awesome. So I’m wondering, if someone is running a business, what would be- they be looking at? What would be happening in their lives right now where they actually need to be hiring you? H- how would

Kirsten Graham: Uh, sure. Yeah, so I still offer one-on-one coaching. It’s really funny, I hadn’t taken on new clients in a while [00:40:00] because I’ve, I have clients I’ve had for over a decade. But I, I recently have started taking on some new one-on-one clients, which has been fun. So if you’re, if you’re just feeling overwhelmed or you don’t have a strategy, that’s something we do in one-on-one coaching.

If you really wanna start a podcast, or if you know guesting on podcasts would be a great marketing strategy, that’s something else we can help you with. So these are the- we just wanna help people… So we don’t offer virtual assistance for everything, and the reason why we don’t do that is because we have very detailed SOPs.

So we interview and vet all of the virtual assistants. So for example, Tim, if you said, "Well, I need someone to produce my podcast," you know, we interview them, we vet them, they go through a paid internship with us. They work with you two weeks, um, with our hiring manager and training manager, because we wanna make sure the client understands all of the structure and the SOPs that we provide so that everything gets done week after week consistently.

So we have really dialed in processes, and that’s why our clients have such great success. Uh, we have clients going on six years with the same [00:41:00] VA, so that’s, that’s our goal.

Tim Melanson: of course is good advice for anybody. Niche in, figure out exactly what you do so you c- you’re an expert in that area, right?

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely, yeah. And it’s hard, ’cause sometimes people are like, "Oh, well, I want you to do this." And it’s like, well, I can give you some outsourcing companies that I think have good reputations, but, you know, we can’t be all things to all people. And that’s the other thing I would say if you’ve started a business.

It’s really easy to say yes to projects or clients that are not ideal. It’s gonna eat away at your soul. It almost always ends up costing you money. So, figure out who your ideal client is and how you can serve them, um, to, to the best of your ability. And, and that sometimes means saying no

Tim Melanson: Yeah. Is that something that you also help, uh, a client with is to figure that out?

Kirsten Graham: To figure out, sorry

Tim Melanson: Who their ideal client is

Kirsten Graham: Yes, in one-on-one coaching we can definitely go through all of that. Um, yeah, we have a process for that. So yeah, absolutely

Tim Melanson: Awesome. So how do we find out more?

Kirsten Graham: Uh, so you can go to [00:42:00] sixfigurebusinesscoaching.com, sixfigurebusinesscoaching.com. If you really wanna get your finances in order, we host a master class twice a month, and you can sign up for that at lessmathmoremoney.com, lessmathmoremoney.com

Tim Melanson: Awesome. Awesome. Hey, uh, I think everybody’s gonna like that. Except for me, I like math, but whatever. I still like money, too.

Kirsten Graham: You, you’re kind of like creative with a math brain. The music and the coding kind of co- in some ways go hand-in-hand, I think

Tim Melanson: Uh, there’s a lot of math in music. So you’ll find a lot of crossovers between musicians and mathematicians, for sure.

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely

Tim Melanson: Hey, speaking of musicians, so tell me, who is your favorite rock star?

Kirsten Graham: Oh my gosh. I always loved Tom, Tom Petty back in the day. I’m gonna age myself. I love the Grateful Dead.

Tim Melanson: Wow

Kirsten Graham: yeah, so probably more older rock, I guess, ’80s and ’90s stuff

Tim Melanson: Nice. Did you [00:43:00] see them live at all?

Kirsten Graham: Yes, I’ve saw, I saw The Dead and Petty, Tom Petty Live, yes, several times. The Eagles. Yeah

Tim Melanson: The Eagles too, yeah. Oh, so good. Right on. Yeah, I love, I love all that music too. Tom Petty is one of my favorites as well. And, uh, the Grateful Dead, I, I didn’t listen to a whole bunch of them. Um, but I did go see Phish, which is a similar type band.

Kirsten Graham: Kingfish too, yeah.

Tim Melanson: Yeah, those, those are experiences.

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely. And then Fleetwood Mac. I love Fleetwood Mac too.

Tim Melanson: Awesome. L- you love classic rock then?

Kirsten Graham: I do. Classic rock kind of girl.

Tim Melanson: Is that the kind of stuff you sing in the shower?

Kirsten Graham: Oh, I don’t sing in the shower. I get downloads. I’m in the shower and all of a sudden an idea comes for a client or an idea for a blog post. So

Tim Melanson: Awesome

Kirsten Graham: time is usually my, uh… I think it’s when I’m relaxed and all of a sudden, like, good ideas come into play. So that’s my idea space

Tim Melanson: Is that, is the car your idea of space too?

Kirsten Graham: In some cases, but a lot of times now I spend so much [00:44:00] time either working, meeting on calls with people, or dictating. Like, so that when I get back I can, uh, uh, just copy and paste it into chat and figure out what I need to do with whatever I dictated. So not as much. Plus I work from home, so I’m not usually out driving a lot.

It’s not like I have to commute to and from work. So I would definitely say the shower. I, I live in Florida, so the beach. We go to the beach a lot. So those, those are my favorite places. Water, water-

Tim Melanson: I live in Canada. Oh, you know what? The one thing about living in Canada is that you really appreciate the summer.

Kirsten Graham: Absolutely. Yeah, we have a lot of Canadian clients and, um, you know, I, uh, but it- where you live is so beautiful. Like, I always see pictures of our, you know, with our clients up there and, you know, you’re surrounded by water. It’s just frozen most of the time. But it is, it is beautiful. You guys have such gorgeous and different types of landscapes.

Tim Melanson: Yep. Yeah. I used to, uh, I used to do a lot of traveling down to the States and to Florida, and it was, I just thought it was always funny [00:45:00] that we would go down there and, uh, there’d be a group of us, and everybody who lives there would be in the air conditioning, and we’re outside.

Kirsten Graham: Yeah.

Tim Melanson: in air conditioning?

Kirsten Graham: Right, or the winter. So we’ve had a really cold winter. I had frost on my windshield one day. But, um, yeah, if we go to the beach, last time I went to the beach my girlfriend wore jeans and a long-sleeve shirt, and so of course we’re kind of bundled up, and obviously the crazy Canadians are swimming, so…

Tim Melanson: Yep. That is awesome. Thank you so much, Kristen, for rocking out with me today. This has been a lot of fun

Kirsten Graham: you. Yeah, it’s been awesome. I really appreciate the conversation.

Tim Melanson: Great. And to the listeners, make sure you go to workathomerockstar.com for more information, and we’ll see you next time on the Work at Home Rockstar podcast